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Recherche sur le Malgache

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etudiant_linguistique - 09/04/2016 11:41
Salut ! Désolé de déranger (et excuser pour mon mauvais français). Je m’appelle Remco van der Veen et je suis étudiant en première année de Master Recherche en Linguistique aux Pays-Bas. Je suis en train de faire une petite recherche sur le Malgache dans le cadre d’un cours de mon université. Pour ma recherche, il me faut des locuteurs natifs de Malgache. En remplissant le questionnaire ci-dessous, vous devrez donner votre avis sur quelques phrases et indiquer les différences qui existent entre celles étroitement liées. Le questionnaire est composé de trois parties et il vous faudra environ 10-15 minutes pour le remplir. Si vous me aider en remplissant ce questionnaire, je serais très reconnaissant. Merci d’avance pour votre aide.

Sincères salutations,
Remco van der Veen.

Lien/link: http://goo.gl/forms/xxsgdZCaOG


Hello, there! Sorry to intrude. My name is Remco van der Veen, a research master student of linguistics from the Netherlands, and I am currently doing research on Malagasy. For my research, I need some native speakers of Malagasy. You will be asked to judge some sentences and to indicate some differences between closely related sentences. The entire survey consists of three parts and will take approximately 10-15 minutes to fill in. If you would help me by filling in this survey, I would be very grateful. Thanks in advance for your help.

Kind regards,
Remco van der Veen

Link: http://goo.gl/forms/xxsgdZCaOG
Valio | Miverina eny ambony
hery - 09/04/2016 11:57
Document introuvable
Valio | Miverina eny ambony
etudiant_linguistique - 09/04/2016 12:00
J'essaie encore: http://goo.gl/forms/xxsgdZCaOG
Valio | Miverina eny ambony
vaotonga - 10/04/2016 18:22
Hi, how are you? Nice to meet you! What do you want us to do for you? Because for me personally, I do not know what you want. Do you want us to correct these sentences? Or do you want us to explain to you the meaning of these sentences? Can you give us in French or in English the meaning of what you want to say in these sentences? Some of your sentences are grammatically correct but some of them are not. Bye now.
Valio | Miverina eny ambony
etudiant_linguistique - 10/04/2016 23:34
Thank you for replying! What I want is for you to simply say which ones are correct and which ones are not. I am aware that some are ungrammatical, but it is sometimes deliberately so, and at other times it is me trying to see if something is possible. If you see those in the survey, simply click the "1" for ungrammatical. It will be my job to interpret your judgements when I start analysing them. I hope it is clear what I mean.
Valio | Miverina eny ambony
vaotonga - 11/04/2016 04:08
Hi mate, I have tried to give my opinion about your request but I do not know how to send them to you. So tell me what to do now. All the best!
Valio | Miverina eny ambony
etudiant_linguistique - 11/04/2016 11:13
No problem. Just click the link above, follow the instructions, and I will get the information in my mailbox. If that doesn't work for you, I could send you my e-mail in a private message.
Valio | Miverina eny ambony
vaotonga - 12/04/2016 04:56
Ok, I will click according to my opinion and if you have any question to ask me, please! I'm here and happy to help you. I am 100% Malagasy people.
Valio | Miverina eny ambony
etudiant_linguistique - 12/04/2016 14:29
Thank you! Are you the one offering to help me fix sentences in the comment section?
Citation
Reviens sur le forum si tu veux que les phrases soient corrigées et expliquées.


If so, there are indeed a couple of these sentences of which I would like the 'good' form to compare. Most preferably these:
- Misarika ny vehivavy eo amin'ny tenany ny lehilahy.
- Sarihan'ny lehilahy eo amin'ny tenany ny vehivavy.
- Mandroritra ranon'ny tany eny amin'ny tenany ny volana.
- Roritin'ny volana eny amin'ny tenany ny ranon'ny tany.
- Androritan'ny volana ny ranon'ny tany ny tenany.

What I'm curious about is: why are they wrong? what would be the right versions? and do they mean what they are supposed to mean? Namely:
- The man pulls the woman towards himself.
- The moon attracts the water of the earth to itself.

(and why is "Isarihan'ny lehilahy ny vehivavy ny tenany." right?)

Let me know if I am unclear anywhere. I really appreciate your offer for help.
Valio | Miverina eny ambony
5laody - 13/04/2016 12:18

etudiant_linguistique
Thank you! Are you the one offering to help me fix sentences in the comment section?
Citation
Reviens sur le forum si tu veux que les phrases soient corrigées et expliquées.


If so, there are indeed a couple of these sentences of which I would like the 'good' form to compare. Most preferably these:
- Misarika ny vehivavy eo amin'ny tenany ny lehilahy.
- Sarihan'ny lehilahy eo amin'ny tenany ny vehivavy.
- Mandroritra ranon'ny tany eny amin'ny tenany ny volana.
- Roritin'ny volana eny amin'ny tenany ny ranon'ny tany.
- Androritan'ny volana ny ranon'ny tany ny tenany.

What I'm curious about is: why are they wrong? what would be the right versions? and do they mean what they are supposed to mean? Namely:
- The man pulls the woman towards himself.
- The moon attracts the water of the earth to itself.

(and why is "Isarihan'ny lehilahy ny vehivavy ny tenany." right?)

Let me know if I am unclear anywhere. I really appreciate your offer for help.

Hi, I think that you use too much the term "ny tenany", it is not oftenly used or only used in very very formal speeches in very old texts. it is interpreted as "the body" (het lichaam).

in the four first sentences, if you replace "ny tenany" with "ho eny aminy" they sounds better.
so you obtain
-misarika ny vehivavy ho eny aminy ny lehilahy (Men pulls the women towards themselves.)
-sarihan'ny lehilahy ho eny aminy ny vehivavy (Women are pulled by men toward themselves)
- Mandroritra ranon'ny tany ho any aminy ny volana.(The moon attracts the water of the earth to itself.)
-roritin'ny volana ho eny aminy (ou mankany aminy) ny ranon'ny tany. (The water of the earth is attracted by the moon to itself)

for the last one, it is a bit complicated, it means textually: "the moon is used by itself
to attract the water of the earth" (does the moon really use something? does it use the moon attraction?)

and about "Isarihan'ny lehilahy ny vehivavy ny tenany." I've put it correct in the way as I have translated it as: "Men use their bodies to attract women"

it's a kind of passive form which is not used in english or in dutch.
hope that it helps.
Valio | Miverina eny ambony
etudiant_linguistique - 13/04/2016 15:42
Thank you! This is useful information. The reason I use 'ny tenany' a lot is because I'm interested in the difference in use between tena/ny tenany. So far, it appears 'ny tenany' can occur in more constructions than 'tena', but if you say you prefer a different word in those cases, that is definitely interesting.

If you were forced to use 'ny tenany' (or 'tena') in these sentences, how would you do it? Especially with the verb 'isarihan', I'm curious if 'ny tenany' can still mean 'himself' instead of 'his body'.
Valio | Miverina eny ambony
5laody - 13/04/2016 16:51

etudiant_linguistique
Thank you! This is useful information. The reason I use 'ny tenany' a lot is because I'm interested in the difference in use between tena/ny tenany. So far, it appears 'ny tenany' can occur in more constructions than 'tena', but if you say you prefer a different word in those cases, that is definitely interesting.

If you were forced to use 'ny tenany' (or 'tena') in these sentences, how would you do it? Especially with the verb 'isarihan', I'm curious if 'ny tenany' can still mean 'himself' instead of 'his body'.


may be i would write: "isarihan'ny lehilahy ny vehivavy ho eny aminy ny tenany" but it seems to me using a concrete sentence to talk about something abstract.
Valio | Miverina eny ambony
vaotonga - 14/04/2016 03:36
Hello, I have given to you my opinion but I do not know if you got it or not because up to now I have not got any reply from you. You said that click only and you will get the answer of your request from me and I have done it. So did you get my answer or not? Best wishes.
Valio | Miverina eny ambony
etudiant_linguistique - 15/04/2016 15:56
Thank you, 5laody, for your reply.

vaotonga
Hello, I have given to you my opinion but I do not know if you got it or not because up to now I have not got any reply from you. You said that click only and you will get the answer of your request from me and I have done it. So did you get my answer or not? Best wishes.


Yes, I have received it, thank you! Actually, I figured it was you who told me to come back to the forum with the questions. The results are filled in anonymously, so it is hard to tell who exactly gave me which answer, but I really appreciate all the responses I get. So thank you for helping me!
Valio | Miverina eny ambony
etudiant_linguistique - 15/04/2016 15:58
I am currently rounding off this research. The results and various conversations with speakers of Malagasy have been very informative. Thanks to all who helped me by filling in the questionnaire or by answering questions. Perhaps, if my teachers like the results, I can start a follow-up research with better questions, now that I understand more of the language.

Je suis actuellement arrondir cette recherche. Les resultats et les différentes conversations avec des locuteurs du Malagasy ont été très instructif. Merci à tous ceux qui m'a aidé en remplissant le questionnaire ou en répondant à des questions. Peut-être, si les enseignants aiment les résultats, je peux commencer une recherche de suivi avec de meilleures questions, puisque je comprends maintenant la langue un peu mieux.
Valio | Miverina eny ambony
vaotonga - 16/04/2016 05:35

Hello, you got my answer anonymously because you ask us to click only one of the number 1 to 5. Anyway, do you understand all my answers? God bless.
Valio | Miverina eny ambony